So ask away.
Have gamblers ever consider the implications of what the existence of a perfect, long lived pattern implies?
How many walk up to a Roulette table and start betting their system without checking it to see what is happening first?
Have you bothered to learn the condition that will make your system crash?
Can situational awareness be programmed into a player?
What do you think learning to read randomness is for?
Do you think there is a system that is easy and is a trick, so that you will be able to retire as a gambling pro?
I think many here dream of an easy way to play Roulette. Many times, several have spent all their energy trying to convince claimers that they need to share their secrets of their success. It always turns into a begging and pleading effort to be given someone else's holy grail. Has anyone produced that holy grail yet? The answer is an emphatic "NO."
Nobody has successfully been shown the holy grail over begging and pleading.
Can you wreck a holy grail by publishing it on the internet. If you owned a casino would you defend your profits? If you knew of an advantage would would you shut it down? What are the chances that you will find a holy grail that you will actually be able to use?
It's time to think. You must love chasing the banana on a string, I guess. The holy grail is not going to make an appearance for you, ever. You are going to have to figure it out for yourselves. That is the kindest advice you will hear today. The day you set out to figure out a game of randomness is the day that you give your effort a real chance. Because the roulette wheel is nothing but a mechanical random number generator. It stands to reason that you need to understand every thing you can about randomness.
Consider this. Random streams of spins can do anything in the short term span of 200 spins. Why would your system be ready to go just because you entered the casino? Isn't that what you are searching for anyway. You just want to walk up and make a withdrawal with your ATM styled machine system. Why do you not learn to recognize the character of randomness. Specifically, why don't you learn when things tend to reoccur? Why don't you know how to recognize reoccurring situations? You can't see anything that you have not spent time learning to recognize. It's like learning a new language. You recognize words don't you.
Weather forecasters recognize developing dangers. They play that through as if what has happened in the past matters. They recognize patterns in order to save lives. Is reading randomness any different? Imagine there was a weather man that comes out and forecasts swarms of like typed patterns are forming on table five in the smoke free lounge. That the streaks are joined together instead of chaotic on table two in the main section. That's what it takes if you are a self achieved ignoramus. You need someone to hold your hand and put money into your wallet. Now that is a funny way to present yourself to a community of friends. That's the way I see almost all of you. You are very needy. You almost all of you have your hands out. Some of you are admittedly new at gambling. Achievement is not becoming a successful beggar on a forum. It's a monumental failing. It could lead to costing you too. So don't do that to yourself if you are new to gambling.
QuoteBothered you have to learn the condition that will make your system crash?
Yes, now when I start to consider a system, the first thing I do is try to determine if the bad part can be clearly recognized. No use in betting something when in the dark.
Now I know for fact bet that the same selection will not always work, so my exercise is to work Actuals with a marker in identifying the current moment to be good or bad for bet selection. Yes, easy to spot after the play but not impossible during the play. Because it comes in chains.
It is too bad if the major chain of loses for the system is not spotted. The bad chain has to be clearly spotted to become better non-bettor, and if many of these bad chains coming then better to leave because "it is not your day." Not betting is important because the not loss chip can be saved or used other better moment of stream and perhaps win.
If we save the loss of single units in the short time we are increasing the possibility that we get good data to benefit us. The fact is you can not bet when good moment is in if you don't have bank left to hit and leave.
I totally agree with Mr. Gizmotron that people recognizes only the ones which is trained to recognize, and if is not recognized when the system tends to lose then no advantage can be obtained because then why are you going to run out of bank and you're not even aware what happened, as all the other chips that water on the cloth of the table by people who gambles without reason and without rithm to the data.
Example, using the sequence DBL the killer is chained series 2.
When series 2 are "King" then why do we play this installment? Better wait for a better stretch where there is scarcity of the series 2.
Never bet the chains of series 2 when betting DBL. It may sound simple, but even if there are several sets of row 2, people will think that the next launch will be the end of series 2 and can begin to win big. But roulette is not to reward the players contrary to it, but those that synchronize with it.
Guaranteed in the long-term series of 2 and the other must be balanced to what gives the probability, but in the short term is best determined by how data is currently passing at stream.
How long will the winning trait continue? We do not know. But then you save chips by not betting bad moments. Makes sense to me for short term play.
Be always tje wiser player than last year.
WannaWin
Quotenow when I start to consider a system, the first thing I do is try to determine if the bad part can be clearly recognized. No use in betting something when in the dark
Me too, i do the same but alas the bad part can never be clearly recognized as it's a random game. When i think the bad part is over a new bad part begins once again. Of course, there are fugace moments where i think i might get an advantage but alas it never lasts. What to do ?
When I think the bad part is over a new bad part begins once again.>>
There are no 'bad parts', there are just outcomes that don't fit into your system. You don't know how to read random, so its all very puzzling to you.
Quote from: Spike on May 15, 2009, 11:52:21 PM
There are no 'bad parts', there are just outcomes that don't fit into your system. You don't know how to read random, so its all very puzzling to you.
So much for the truth. They don't get it Spike. Everything is in motion on it's way to becoming something else. Those that discuss understanding randomness and possible discerning what it's doing, well they seem to describe getting bitten by it alot. There is a lack of agility in their perceptions. They are like a jet pilot that gets behind the plane. That's not a good way to fly in combat and it even worse while playing what is happening in Roulette. One gets you killed for real the other kills your bankroll.
Watch them talk about using patterns and randomness. They have already admitted to reacting too late alot. They only see the basics and are still lacking massive amounts of experience. It's fun to watch though. Some of them are trying baby steps. That puts them miles ahead of the others.
Quote from: Arteinvivo on May 16, 2009, 05:33:45 PM
As I can see through your replys you don't have anything serious to say or even remotely connected to the original topic "Get answers to your questions about randomness". All I can say is put up or shut up.
Don't be a total retard Arte. The point is for you to seek and get answers. Your obvious lack of interest in randomness makes me wonder what you would ask in the first place. I don't provide the answers unless questions are asked. Nobody is asking anything. The point was to seek, get off your butt and seek for yourself. The only answer is the one you give yourself. You are nothing but a do nothing gambler that wants an easy system to make your ATM type withdrawals with. You won't get an easy answer in an effort made to learning to read randomness.
Maybe the title should be "Arte, get answers to your questions about randomness by working very hard to discover them.
You could of course complain all you want. You know what that will get you.
I much prefer games of ping pong. At least, when I win it's because of my ability and not a random chance :yahoo:
You are right on one point, i don't consider random games anymore since i began trading. Nothing compares to that.
"What do you think learning to read randomness is for?"
How do you read randomness? My question is just that if it is random then it is not possible to read it right?
Cheers
Jakk
Jakk,
I think you're right. You can't read random.
I think you have to learn how to decipher it then read that with something else.
I think you're right. You can't read random.>>
At one time in your life you couldn't read anything and then you learned how. Amazing..
Quote from: bombus on May 17, 2009, 07:45:00 PM
Jakk,
I think you're right. You can't read random.
I think you have to learn how to decipher it then read that with something else.
Perhaps that is only a semantic argument. You use combinations of alphabetic characters to see words. In English there are only 26 characters. Of that, there are rules that are generally followed in order to obtain meaning. Like the word "to" and the word "too" for instance.
In randomness there are characteristics to different forms or states available to it, and that could easily be described as the alphabet of randomness. Randomness follows probability when it is at it's neutral state. In other words, what you see happening is right along the lines of distribution expectations for long term results, as a temporary state. So one aspect of randomness is to notice if it is above or below that trend line for the normal temporary state. Then there is noticing trends of flow patterns. They exist in every system, betting scheme, table layout combinations, etc... They follow the same type of characteristic tendencies. At no time does math have a predictability or rule that can effect patterns and trends. If you think they can then that is believing in a math fallacy. In fact it needs a name, "gambler's math fallacy." Now live with that math absolutists. You have to live with those that know you are only depending on a math's fallacy.
I have yet to be offered a coherent math argument that dispels pattern recognition and clustering analysis. All I'm ever offered is probability and distribution odds. Those concepts only hold true of the mechanical device providing the randomness in the first place. There is no cognitive decision making concepts allowed in such a sterile environment. It's the gambler that makes the mistakes. Understanding the normal flat line state of probability is only a guiding mechanism to education of higher beings. You must be smarter than the wheel. After all, it's only wood, metal parts, and ball bearings.
Ocne you boecme pfirconiet in the Eglnsih lgganaue, yuor biran wlil rdailey dpcieehr wdors eevn wehn tehy are jembuld up pvodreid the fsirt and lsat ltretes rimean in pacle.
To read random proficiently, do we need something to anchor to as in the above sentence?
If so, in regard to roulette, is there the possibility of creating a universal language for random reading purposes?
Quote from: bombus on May 17, 2009, 11:47:48 PM
Ocne you boecme pfirconiet in the Eglnsih lgganaue, yuor biran wlil rdailey dpcieehr wdors eevn wehn tehy are jembuld up pvodreid the fsirt and lsat ltretes rimean in pacle.
To read random proficiently, do we need something to anchor to as in the above sentence?
If so, in regard to roulette, is there the possibility of creating a universal language for random reading purposes?
You need to anchor yourself in practice. The more you focus on one thing happening to a selected group the more you can see the same characteristic in many more groups. Then you see it in just about everything. Randomness effects everything. It's universal in using it.
Yet randomness is just exactly that....randomness.Nothing is telling randomness to distribute a certain selection or group of numbers within a certain amount of spins.....short term or longterm. That is because it's random. That or ...... the roulette wheel is not totally random as previously thought. Look at RNG. Is it crooked? Is it 100% random? If not, is it closer to random than the real wheel?
Maybe RNG is seen as crooked because it is closer to randomness than the real wheel. Who determines what is truly random and what is not?
Not trying to be difficult just want to point out some of my thoughts
Cheers
Jakk
Quote from: Jakkalsdraai on May 18, 2009, 01:55:52 AM
Yet randomness is just exactly that....randomness.Nothing is telling randomness to distribute a certain selection or group of numbers within a certain amount of spins.....short term or longterm. That is because it's random. That or ...... the roulette wheel is not totally random as previously thought. Look at RNG. Is it crooked? Is it 100% random? If not, is it closer to random than the real wheel?
Maybe RNG is seen as crooked because it is closer to randomness than the real wheel. Who determines what is truly random and what is not?
Not trying to be difficult just want to point out some of my thoughts
Cheers
Jakk
I disagree with your opinion, perception, and your lack of knowledge altogether. It has lead directly to you displaying your gambling prowess as amateurish at best.
Just look at this deduction, "Nothing is telling randomness to distribute a certain selection..." Like duh dood! There is nothing but gravity, inertia, velocity, acceleration, and time to say the least. All of these random factors add up to almost perfect randomness. Add to that low sided boundaries for each slot and you get an almost truly random mechanism. Here is a clue. Nothing is preventing randomness from distributing in a repetitious pattern or trend. When will you stop looking for the cause of patterns, trends, dominances, and global effects? They just exist. They exist because that is the nature of randomness. They exist in the person that recognizes them. If nobody was there to notice them they would still exist.
Here you go. You need it to be magic. So little green men from Mars make the Roulette randomness, perception illusion an insider's feature of the conquest of planet Earth.
Why does everyone want randomness to be a predictor? I'm guessing that it's that way for them because they can easily understand it that way. It would provide them with a simple set of rules to gamble by. Sorry, you are going to have to use that space between your ears. That is the great expanse to overcome.
Did you crack my code yet?
:girl_wacko:
Gizmo,
Reading through your posts it appears that you are somewhat experienced with regards to roulette? Infact I would go as far as to say you would have us all believe you are 'some kind of God' is this true? ???
May I be so bold as to politely ask, instead of merely making fun of us 'mere mortals' you actually
contribute something helpful; after all that is the whole purpose of this forum 'to help each other' is it not? ;)
Quote from: Number Six on May 18, 2009, 10:54:12 AM
Did you crack my code yet?
:girl_wacko:
Did you eat a pile of steaming dog-doo yet?
Quote from: Gizmotron
Did you eat a pile of steaming dog-doo yet?
:girl_wacko:
I had to go into the pit to dig it up but here it is:
OmP+yYPTBfv0nfGY10wZWjXosafDUrD/+A/6Xm01Geh+77+OYEEgYRISfwz91SnF21qjASg8QeMJ0myM
XCJVmMGTMWmECOTm5HBrOXHgRbR27/U889QIQZ83ZrIDg2i3+y9VespVQNEXw5Vonsj3ulbxuWzN56f5
Ok Gizmo..... Where in hell did I in any sense seem to insult you to receive a reply like that?
"I disagree with your opinion, perception, and your lack of knowledge altogether. It has lead directly to you displaying your gambling prowess as amateurish at best."
Yes I am a amateur roulette player.......what are you professional?
"gravity, inertia, velocity, acceleration, and time to say the least. All of these random factors add up to almost perfect randomness." Says who? It is especially those factors that does have an constant effect and does not make it random. As far as i know gravity is a constant not true? So is inertia.....Speed and accelleration....well if VB guys can recognise them as a constant in certain environments, then that also is pretty much constant. Now we get to the deflectors. How many wheels we see one dominant deflector....many! So alot of wheels have a dominant dropzone. So is it random then? Hell no. Not if a person can predict where it will fall via balistics. Try RNG, that is random. Try predicting that.
Anyhow. I'm disappointed in your somewhat defensive reply. What i put down in my post was really to find out more of your ways and your believes, not in any way to attack you. You seem to think just that, or you see yourself as high and mighty and you are just an asshole. I don't know which of the two it is. Anyhow no bother then. I will keep to myyself and to other threads. All the best and sorry for interfering in your ....... thread.
Cheers
Jakk
Quote from: bali96 on May 18, 2009, 11:01:14 AM
Gizmo,
Reading through your posts it appears that you are somewhat experienced with regards to roulette? Infact I would go as far as to say you would have us all believe you are 'some kind of God' is this true? ???
May I be so bold as to politely ask, instead of merely making fun of us 'mere mortals' you actually
contribute something helpful; after all that is the whole purpose of this forum 'to help each other' is it not? ;)
I've handed you the holy grail. You see it as a t**d.
Let's see, I've spent 40 years discovering Roulette. That includes making my own mechanical random generator and teaching myself computer programing. In all that time I learned that all rule based systems fail to produce a worthwhile and acceptable result. If I encounter others along the way, that are decades behind me, and have not made an effort to discover the truth by actually working it out, then I'm not going to encourage them to settle for half baked systems that can't work. No, I'm not the god of roulette. You are just the lackey of roulette. It's all adds up to your position in the grand scheme of things. Your feelings as a student should not dictate your learning capacity. You never train mountain climbers by being nice to them. It always leads to people dieing. I would have to say that gambling is economically perilous. The worst thing you can do to a new gambler is to encourage them to get killed at the casino. Practice practice practice, that's what matters.
Quote from: Number Six on May 18, 2009, 11:13:55 AM
:girl_wacko:
I had to go into the pit to dig it up but here it is:
OmP+yYPTBfv0nfGY10wZWjXosafDUrD/+A/6Xm01Geh+77+OYEEgYRISfwz91SnF21qjASg8QeMJ0myM
XCJVmMGTMWmECOTm5HBrOXHgRbR27/U889QIQZ83ZrIDg2i3+y9VespVQNEXw5Vonsj3ulbxuWzN56f5
Number -six, you are off topic. You are a disrupter.
Quote from: Jakkalsdraai on May 18, 2009, 11:24:57 AM
Ok Gizmo..... Where in hell did I in any sense seem to insult you to receive a reply like that?
"I disagree with your opinion, perception, and your lack of knowledge altogether. It has lead directly to you displaying your gambling prowess as amateurish at best."
Yes I am a amateur roulette player.......what are you professional?
"gravity, inertia, velocity, acceleration, and time to say the least. All of these random factors add up to almost perfect randomness." Says who? It is especially those factors that does have an constant effect and does not make it random. As far as I know gravity is a constant not true? So is inertia.....Speed and accelleration....well if VB guys can recognise them as a constant in certain environments, then that also is pretty much constant. Now we get to the deflectors. How many wheels we see one dominant deflector....many! So alot of wheels have a dominant dropzone. So is it random then? Hell no. Not if a person can predict where it will fall via balistics. Try RNG, that is random. Try predicting that.
Anyhow. I'm disappointed in your somewhat defensive reply. What I put down in my post was really to find out more of your ways and your believes, not in any way to attack you. You seem to think just that, or you see yourself as high and mighty and you are just an asshole. I don't know which of the two it is. Anyhow no bother then. I will keep to myyself and to other threads. All the best and sorry for interfering in your ....... thread.
Cheers
Jakk
OK, you are a disrupter too. You want to hijack this topic. The topic is randomness, not physics.
There will never be an end to those that think that reading randomness is about using predictors or having control because of something that is claimed to be a prediction. It's like a mental block that acts like a blinder to those individuals. I don't have the ability to reach these sorry individuals. They can go jump in a lake. Soon I'll have the ability to erase these nay saying disrupter's that only want to talk VB and DS. Nothing works on them. They only come here to expect answers to their pet interests. Get a section (life.)
Answer this: What's the difference between randomness and bias? Can you prove that bias is the only thing happening when temporary randomness produces bias type results? Can you see when a real bias and randomness couples together to produce a super bias? Can you see when randomness counter balances an existing bias to negate its effect? The person that does not study randomness does not have the full picture.
Okay I'll get the thread "rolling". What would the first step be if I wanted to learn to read randomness? Is there a process that can aid someone learn these skills?
have anyone there think about randomness like a huge advantage ??? how many time u was seen this 1 36 3 15 10 15?? now can u tell me which number come next ?? offcourse not but when see before outcome with many repeaters pattern where will be next your bet ???DONT TAKE ME WRONG BUT EVEN RANDOMNESS HAS A NICE PATTERN )))
I've handed you the holy grail. You see it as a t**d?!!! :scratch_ones_head:
About as much use as a chocolate teapot, more interested in your own self importance more like... We are not worthy...we are not worthy! :pleasantry:
Quote from: bali96 on May 18, 2009, 11:48:21 AM
I've handed you the holy grail. You see it as a t**d?!!! :scratch_ones_head:
About as much use as a chocolate teapot, more interested in your own self importance more like... We are not worthy...we are not worthy! :pleasantry:
This is how much I care about you. You have only illustrated one of the detracting features of discussing a topic. Thank you for illustrating your own diminished capacity of self awareness too. Projecting your anger on me is adolescent at best. I'm here talking about randomness because people dismiss it. I'm more fascinated that the holy grail goes undiscovered by those that never fail to beg for it in the first place. It's the ultimate joke. Every word you say is another joke. The best part is that you will use anything but randomness when you go into a casino. That's so funny I can't stop laughing. BTW, you are also afraid to be wrong. You obviously find it as a weakness in me. I know I'm right about reading randomness. I have yet to see a working mechanical, rule based system. If you ever see one then go on the TV talk show circuit. You need to win a Nobel prize for that.
Think I touched a nerve there :spiteful: LMFAO ;D
Quote from: Shorty on May 18, 2009, 11:40:15 AM
Okay I'll get the thread "rolling". What would the first step be if I wanted to learn to read randomness? Is there a process that can aid someone learn these skills?
Yes, use a chart to see past spins. Use at least six different full groupings. R-B, O-E, L-H, d1-d2-d3, c1-c2-c3. Do it in a way so you can see what is currently happening.
Learn what the nature of series for singles and doubles teaches you for each of these groupings. While looking at many ways to base your observations of the characteristics you should always keep track of a base line that follows distribution statistics. There exists a normal base line for each group. You can then use that to see dominances. They don't have to be symmetrical in order to be useful.
If you don't understand that then spend months learning binomial distribution, series, and probability. Learn how it applies to a short session of 100 spins and a longer session of 300 spins. 1,000,000 spins are irrelevant other than giving you a base line.
That's step one.
Quote from: casinopitbull on May 18, 2009, 11:47:34 AM
have anyone there think about randomness like a huge advantage ??? how many time u was seen this 1 36 3 15 10 15?? now can u tell me which number come next ??
The answer is any number from column 3, (3-36). You have c1, c3, c3, c3, c1, c3. If that holds up for one more spin then c3 will hit.
Just about all of you can't see this because you don't understand the use of it. The point is to search for what is working. If you enter a stretch of patterns, where most of the first moves to bet them loses, then don't do that. You have a dominance for when first moves lose. There is dominance in everything you attempt. They exist as above the base line, below the base line, on the base line, and forms of chop. Not only does it apply to pattern recognition and clustering analysis but it applies to the win loss, bet selection process too. There are base lines for successful stretches of the gambling session. It's everywhere if you teach yourself how to see it.
So to be true to myself, you must do your own work. Someone can get you started but you will have to learn it on your own. It has to be so difficult that they will value their own effort after they have done it. It must be for those that aren't afraid to learn something new and to do enough work that it begins to give you an advantage. If you complain about that then too bad. Nobody directed me to learn this. This is my own original learning process without anyone giving me first step advice. I'm truly fascinated by those that have been pointed in the right direction with the hopes that complaining will get them an "easy button" lesson.
Quote from: bali96 on May 18, 2009, 12:07:40 PM
Think I touched a nerve there :spiteful: LMFAO ;D
No, you are the one hanging around just in case you might learn something. Just because your perception of the process of getting through to others or yourself is jaded does not mean I have to give a hoot. I've spent two years trying to get interest in randomness, what's working, pattern recognition, and clustering analysis as it relates to Roulette. I'm done with the nay saying disrupters. They have never failed to appear. They have hijacked every thread I started to discuss this. Don't believe me? Just ask those that have been around during all that. I had to deal with Arte and his fake Matrix. That was the first off topic disruption.
What I have done is hand out the truth just to watch it confuse the disrupters. It's the ultimate payback. I would love to see the epiphany, when that comes crashing down.
Nope, you are irrelevant. It would be hilarious if you were to take over and explain randomness. You have the floor.
Gizmo,
Interesting stuff to say the least. Your thread gets to the very core of the whole problem: is Roulette completely random? In this case there is no hope without bias or VB. Or is there any hidden pattern in what seems totally chaotic?
Your pieces are interesting but weak on real substance. You seem to have studied the subject a great deal but for the rest of us, mere mortals, it seems a little bit aloof. This not the way, in my opinion to get positive feed back. I can discuss stuff with you that you know very little about. If I make you feel stupid cos you don't grasp every concept right of the bat, will you pay a lot of attention to my teaching???
Would you please go under Brainstorming, Neural Networks. I wrote a little piece a few months ago that could possibly be of some interest to you. If it is irrelevant, please don't call me an idiot...
Insidebet
Quote from: insidebet on May 31, 2009, 01:51:17 PM
Gizmo,
Interesting stuff to say the least. Your thread gets to the very core of the whole problem: is Roulette completely random? In this case there is no hope without bias or VB. Or is there any hidden pattern in what seems totally chaotic?
Your pieces are interesting but weak on real substance. You seem to have studied the subject a great deal but for the rest of us, mere mortals, it seems a little bit aloof. This not the way, in my opinion to get positive feed back. I can discuss stuff with you that you know very little about. If I make you feel stupid cos you don't grasp every concept right of the bat, will you pay a lot of attention to my teaching???
Would you please go under Brainstorming, Neural Networks. I wrote a little piece a few months ago that could possibly be of some interest to you. If it is irrelevant, please don't call me an idiot...
Insidebet
Go ahead, suggest a hypotheses or present your basic position. I hope it relates to the topic. You can stop pretending to be delicate about being condescending. I assure you that randomness & I can take it. Just leave out the posturing. It's OK to be so smart that we can't stand it. I removed many of my posts in this section because of disruptions by others.
I did notice that you have no questions about randomness and that you present yourself as understanding all. You clearly have implied that I'm in error. My gut reaction is to leave you in your great knowledge.
I'm going to the casino for a couple of days so take your time.
Boy! Please get serious. I said nothing condescending or insulting. Several other people here have said exactly the same thing. Of course we are just amateurs and know sweet nothing. I never said you were in error. Only that we know very little about what makes you so special. A lot of guys on this site have stated things like: "There is way to win at this game. But you have to find it for yourself. Don't expect to get it on silver platter". Anyone can state that.
I too think that there may be hidden patterns. Only it goes far beyond the amateurish so-called systems we find here.
I did suggest something: Brainstorming, Neural Networks. Again please, pretty please, take look at the idea. Obviously you did not.
Insidebet
Quote from: insidebet on May 31, 2009, 01:51:17 PM
Gizmo,
I can discuss stuff with you that you know very little about. If I make you feel stupid cos you don't grasp every concept right of the bat, will you pay a lot of attention to my teaching???
... "Boy! Please get serious. I said nothing condescending or insulting. "
Spare us from your great gambling savvy prowess. You have said zilch about Randomness. You are making you the issue here. The topic is Randomness. You are acting ridiculous. You suggest I take up a discussion of Neural Networks with you. Only one problem. You never said anything about it. There is nothing to look at because you are just wasting time here talking about the minutia of internet etiquette and forum decorum. A consortium of people such as yourself would not intimidate me into watching you blab about nothing. If you have something to suggest about randomness then go ahead. Randomness is the topic not me and any others that must put up with attitude trips.
For the record this is your chance. If you blab on and on about anything but Neural Networks or Randomness than I will accept that you can't control yourself. That will get all this ejected, flushed down the toilette.
Gizmotron,
I know you are busy making friends with Insidebet and I really don't want to step into the middle of your bonding, but I'm interested in something. As a plein player, outside bets are irrelevant to me. However, recently I'm growing quite fond of e/c betting. The patterns created by say R and B are quite dissimilar to those created by, say, a compliment 6-plein sectors. What I want to know is, if I were to concentrate my betting on R and B, what should I be looking at as regards spin count before a pattern becomes attackable? For example, if isolated singles were occurring, or clusters of doubles like BBRBBR or BBRRBB...should I be considering these patterns in the very-short term, ie a dozen spins or so or shorter/longer? And would you use a predefined trigger to signify that a pattern has broken. Is this stuff teachable or picked up through practice? Or maybe found in the entrails of a baloney?
:pardon:
Gizmoron,
You are one sick son of a b***h and I honestly feel sorry for you. Best of luck with your life......
Number Six, the secret to understanding when and what works is experience. Spike has been telling you from day one the secret. If you practice at home, using different techniques, you will begin to see why "BBRBBR or BBRRBB" works for you sometimes and when it works best. You should figure out short term repetitive short term advantages that group together in clusters of similarity, as well as longer term dominances. It's all one thing, experience. So practice until you get it. There is no straight answer because conditions change. You need to know from experience what that means to you and your bet selection strategy. That's why it can't be explained. You must experience it for yourself.
It's hard to disagree with anyone that makes the effort and takes the time to understand this. It's illuminating. You can control your decisions while you make experienced choices. You can control when you attack a weakness in the flow of data. Of course there are no guarantees. You just gain the ability to control what comes at you. Truth be told your entire session can be fruitless. But other sessions can be very fruitful. Your attack method should have a consideration for that. You can't lose what you don't put on the table.
Quote from: insidebet on June 01, 2009, 06:57:35 PM
Gizmoron,
You are one sick son of a b*tch and I honestly feel sorry for you. Best of luck with your life......
OK, you can't control yourself. Buzz off. Go to some other section of the forum. You are nothing but a disrupter here.
For your information, what I asked you to look at had everything to do with with randomness. But you are so full of yourself (not to mention something else) that you didn't even bother to look.
Another thing you can't tell me to buzz off unless you have the guts to say it to my face. But I know your type...
Insidebet
Just in case you delete this: I responded to your NN thread.
Quote from: insidebet on March 21, 2009, 11:34:08 AM
VLS,
A neural network tries to emulate the human brain in the sense that it will try to win through trials and errors.
It is a bit like a new born baby at first: it doesn't know anything at all. Just the rules of the game itself. It will make billions of calculations, permutations trying to detect "patterns". That is exact thing most of us are trying to do here.
If there is a Grail involving patterns, a computer should be able to find it.
Anyone that tries can outperform the computer. The human can see similarities that are more like characteristics of form rather than the actual recurrence of an exact duplicate situation. Knowledge of characteristics, learned from practice, are more valuable than simple pattern recognition.
QuoteBut be careful. It has to involve a very large number of possible bet to be meaningful.
You can discern some characteristics and changes in just a few spins, if you have learned how to read randomness that is. You can know something about the situation at spin fifteen out of thirty of the full duration of a known trend type. I noticed a situation that lasted for 40 spins last night at the casino. I hammered it to death vigorously.
Quote from: insidebet on June 01, 2009, 07:22:23 PM
For your information, what I asked you to look at had everything to do with with randomness. But you are so full of yourself (not to mention something else) that you didn't even bother to look.
Another thing you can't tell me to buzz off unless you have the guts to say it to my face. But I know your type...
Insidebet
So far you have blown all your assumptions. That's all you have. BTW, here is another post with nothing. You seem to only want to disrupt the thread. I'm keeping this so that many can have an example of someone that refuses to discuss the topic. It's a great example.
Thanks for the reply.
If I hear you well, your studying of randomness has more to do with art than science. Is that right?
Insider
Quote from: insidebet on June 01, 2009, 07:44:39 PM
Thanks for the reply.
If I hear you well, your studying of randomness has more to do with art than science. Is that right?
Insider
I know many artists of many different forms of expertise. Some have achieved what they have from perseverance and practice, always pushing themselves. You might call them craftsman of a trade. Some of them have studied the techniques of others before stepping up and attempting to be themselves in an original expression. Some have become the definition of the technique.
I have an acquired skill. I deliberately wait for my chance to strike. You would be closer to what I do if you studied the predatory techniques of lions on the African Plains. They wait for the safest method to attack their prey. So survival might be more the correct form. I'm sure that my knowledge of probability has a clear distinction for inclusion in the science end of this too. I use a baseline in order to see the interval created by the situational awareness caused during observation of data flow sets.
Giz, I'm doing an experiment. I have a technique which I use for a plein method that lets me easily track wheel movements from sector to sector, basically analysing the behaviour of the random flow. Each outcome is allocated a code based on certain "mechanics" and the codes generate sequences of results in which exploitable series are very easy to identify. I can adapt the technique for any variety of bet. Yesterday I messed around with R and B and it seemed to work fairly well. What I want to do really is expand my ability to play the game by mastering a new type of simple situational bet. From the off, I'd rather not waste time practising e/cs only to realise that they're impossible to beat. What would you recommend I concentrate on: 1:1 payouts or 2:1 payouts?
QuoteWhat would you recommend I concentrate on: 1:1 payouts or 2:1 payouts?
I don't even bother looking at the ECs. I track nine dozens. Three are based on the wheel layout, six are based on the table layout. I also play the six double streets sometimes. You need a very low costing bet that treads water just to pass through the times when it is not showing an attack time. It's like the 21 players that wait until there is an advantage for them to increase their bets. It's a confirmed advantage in Black Jack. Did you know that if you are pretty sure what dozen is acting like it won't hit, the other two dozens in the similar group become an EC that pay two to one? All you have to do is hunt for sleeping dozens and you have a higher paying EC in the other two.
Obviously it would pay you to track more than nine dozens. I think I will add three more and make it an even dozen based on four sets rather than three. I'll now break the wheel into three slices of a pie. All you do is commit your non table based groups to memory.
Well, I appreciate the clarity, and I agree with most points you have outlined in the thread. And I also think that if people took the time to understand the random flow they would improve their game dramatically and open up the flood gates. This forum could be a great site for production if people were only willing to participate in serious thought and leave the x and y systems at the door. To each his own, though.
:umnik:
Quote from: Number Six on June 02, 2009, 03:21:17 PM
Well, I appreciate the clarity, and I agree with most points you have outlined in the thread. And I also think that if people took the time to understand the random flow they would improve their game dramatically and open up the flood gates. This forum could be a great site for production if people were only willing to participate in serious thought and leave the x and y systems at the door. To each his own, though.
Reading random flow will never be an x and y system. I can describe something that is like it though. It's like riding a mountain bike on a mountain trail that you have never ridden before. You have a skill set on how to round banked turns. You know how tired you will get as you grind uphill for 4,000 vertical feet in altitude. You know how similarities in previous riding conditions apply to maintaining control in new conditions. It's the same with reading randomness. I'm suggesting that most people fall on their butts the first time they ride beyond their experience. I learned this about randomness over many years. I learned to stay on the bike, to stay on the peddles so to speak. I know almost everyone hates this but it was a head on collision with an elegant pattern that made me consider discovery. Nobody believes in them but me. Funny, I rode two in my lifetime. That's two perfect patterns in thirty years. Perhaps elegant patterns will drive all the devils away like gargoyles on building architectures. I hope so. I want all this to be hard. I only want people that earn it using it. It's purely a selfish attempt to protect something worth sharing with only a few people at first. It has the ability to change everything.