Here I am going to post a street system. It is not difficult to understand but you need to spend some time working through the mechanics of it before you can unleash it on the casino.
The bet will see you betting 4 streets at a time. I am going to put up the progression first for the bet.
It is 10 steps, however you will see in my testing from today that I don't pass step 4. Some of you may like to use the extra steps if necessary..
1) 4 chip outlay. win 12. profit 8 / loss 4.
2) 4 chip outlay. win 12. profit 4 / loss 8.
3) 8 chip outlay. win 24. profit 8 / loss 16.
4) 12 chip outlay. win 36. profit 8 / loss 28.
5) 16 chip outlay. win 48. profit 4 / loss 44.
6) 24 chip outlay. win 72. profit 4 / loss 68.
7) 36 chip outlay. win 108. profit 4 / loss 104.
8. 56 chip outlay. win 168. profit 8 / loss 160.
9) 84 chip outlay. win 252. profit 8 / loss 244.
10) 124 chip outlay. win 372. profit 4 / loss 368.
If you lost all 10 steps of that progression, you would have lost 368. But just to give you a typical idea of when the wins come, here is today's test results showing you when the wins came.
2/1/3/3/3/2/4/2/4/2/2/4/2/3/1/1/3/1/1/3/1/2/4/1/1.
Hits on 1 = 8.
Hits on 2 = 7.
Hits on 3 = 6.
Hits on 4 = 4.
The average win is 6 units profit on any win using the 10 step progression. The profit for testing today was 172 units. System to follow.
I'm all ears John Gold, sounds interesting. I like to bet on the streets, so hope your method is one I havent seen before.
cheers
BW
John i am looking foreward to this one what i have seen already is looking VG cant wait TKS Colin :thumbsup:
In this example I will be working with 14 numbers to show you an example of how the system works.
I downloaded them today from a German online casino.
I will give instructions as I go along. I would suggest that to make it easy, you use a sheet of paper and work through it with me. That will give you a good idea of what is going on.
spin 1. 34 <12> 1. this means that on spin 1, number 34 appeared and it belongs to street 12. It is also the first street to appear for my marking purposes.
spin 2. 13 <5> 2.
spin 3. 9 <3> 3.
spin 4. 22 <8> 4.
spin 5. 7 <3> 4. You may be wondering why I have put another 4 here. That is because the 3 street is a repeat. I still only have 4 original streets. Also you will be required to put a line through the first 3 street which was number 9 on spin 3.
spin 6. 15 <5> 4. Still only 4 original streets and because the 5 street here is another repeat, you need to put a line through the first 5 street which was number 13 on spin 2.
spin 7. 19 <7> 5.
spin 8. 16 <6> 6.
spin 9. 28 <10> 7.
spin 10. 1 <1> 8.
------------------------------
Now this is an important part of the system. What you are looking for is 8 original streets to have appeared. When you have found that, you need to mark down the 4 missing streets. Here the 4 missing streets are 2,4,9,11. These are the 4 streets that you will be backing using the steps in the progression. So the next spin which is spin 11 will be the very first bet. You would place a bet on streets 2,4,9,11 and in accordance with the progression, you need to put 1 unit on each.
spin 11. 24 <8> you do not need to mark any more numbers here next to the <8> because you have your original 8 streets now and although these 8 streets will change on a regular basis, you do not need to keep marking 8 down.
What you do need to do here is cross out the previous 8 street which appeared on spin number 4. When you look back over your recorded numbers, you will see plenty of numbers marked out. However you will always be left with 8 original streets.
You lost the first bet and that means a loss a loss of 4 units. This now means you need to move to step 2 of the progression. On step 2 you will be putting 1 unit on streets 2,4,9,11.
spin 12. 35 <12> So you need to cross out the previous 12 street which appeared on spin 1. That was another loss. You are now down a total of 8 units. The next bet requires you to go to step 3 of the progression. This means you need to put 2 units on each of streets 2,4,9,11.
spin 13. 33 <11> Here is the first win and that gives you a profit of 8 units.
Here is another important part of the system which you are now required to implement. You now have 9 original streets because the 11 street is another original street and you can only ever play with 8 streets. What you need to do is go back through your list of numbers and cross out the street which is the furthest back of your alive streets. You will find that it is the 3 street. So you cross this one out. Now you should have 8 original streets that are live and there will be 4 that are missing. The missing ones should now be streets 2,3,4,9.
These 4 missing streets will be your bet on the very next spin. Also because you won the bet on the last spin, you now will start at the beginning of the progression again from step 1. So you are putting 1 unit each on streets 2,3,4,9.
spin 14. 4 <2> That is a winner on the very first step of the progression and a win of 8 units. Now once again you will need to cross out the furthest back live street which is street 5. This now means your 4 missing streets are 3,4,5,9. Remember to go back to step 1 of the progression again because the last bet was a winning bet.
I have tried to explain things as simply as possible and you should work through the example on paper like I suggested to get the hang of it. More to follow.
Thanks John i will study it out on paper to get the hang of the system will be keeping a 20 20 look out for snthing more you put on the forum Take care & Keep'er Lit Colin :thumbsup:
One thing I would like to mention is that it is not necessary to play the 10 step progression to do well with this.
In my testing today, I never went past 4 steps. Stopping after 4 losses is only costing you 28 units. With today's profit of 172 units, you could have afforded a few bust outs at step 4 and you still would have come out well ahead.
It is worth playing around with to see what your comfort level is. Not everybody's idea of fun is risking a 368 unit bankroll (mr j excepted of course) :thumbsup:
You may be wondering what is the basis for this method. Well I have to admit it does involve a bit of gamblers fallacy. When you are looking for the 8 original streets, it can sometimes take a while (maybe 12-15 spins) This leaves you with 4 missing streets. The 4 missing streets = 1 dozen. So with the 10 step progression, I am hoping that a dozen will not go missing for something like 20-25 spins. I know it can and does happen on occasion. The interesting thing with my testing using this particular method is that so far I have not busted out using the 10 steps. It is out there waiting to happen. However I am happy to ride this thing and hope I can stay in front for a while yet.
Hi John , my advice to you is to not bet the slepers,
better the most hot 4 streets or the *middle ones* 4 streets
(choose from the last 12 spins).
Just my way to play 4 streets.
Progressions for online casinos:
1 0,30 x 4 -1,2 2,4
2 0,30 x 4 -2,4 1,2
3 0,50 x 4 -4,4 1,6
4 0,70 x 4 -7,2 1,2
5 1,10 x 4 -11,6 1,6
6 1,70 x 4 -18,4 2
7 2,50 x 4 -28,4 1,6
8 4 x 4 -44,4 3,6
9 6 x 4 -68,4 3,6
10 9 x 4 -104,4 3,6
11 14 x 4 -160,4 7,6
12 22 x 4 -248 15,6
Or
1 0,30 x 4 -1,2 2,4
2 0,30 x 4 -2,4 1,2
3 0,60 x 4 -4,8 2,4
4 1 x 4 -8,8 3,2
5 2 x 4 -16,8 7,2
6 4 x 4 -32,8 15,2
7 8 x 4 -64,8 31,2
8 16 x 4 -128,8 63,2
9 32 x 4 -256,8 127
good luck.
Thank you balint, I will have a good luck at your method sometime today. :thumbsup:
regarding the street system I posted, like I said before, there is no need to use all 10 steps of the progression the way I outlined. It is probably a bit crude doing it that way and could result in a big loss.
Another way would be to play and keep taking the wins on steps 1,2,3. But if you lose on step 4, STOP.
If you are in profit, then great, keep going and absorb the loss. If that puts you behind, you could progress to a double stake when starting the progression again and try and recoup quickly. It would be like a kind of sliding scale. I think as long as you were sensible, this way would cause less damage on a day when things are going against you.
I am going to post a few more examples today for anybody interested. cheers.
Hi John
I am just wondering this system is working on RNG or live casinos or it does not matter?
Anyway I have tried just a few spins on Rng and seems to be fine.
Thanks
Janos
Some examples which I have played a few minutes ago on Rng
I played until the first hit then I started again.
3,3,5,11,6,3,1,5,4,12,5,4,3,5,8,6,7
1,3,4,5,6,8,11,12 2,7,9,10 2nd spins 4unit profit
7,6,5,5,5,7,11,6,5,6,7,5,4,11,4,10,11,8,11,5,5,3
3,4,5,6,7,8,10,11 1,2,9,12 2nd spin 4
11,3,9,12,1,12,8,5,10,
1,3,5,8,9,10,11,12 2,4,6,7 1st spin 8
4,7,9,1,4,4,1,6,4,3,11,10
1,3,4,6,7,9,10,11 2,5,8,12 1st spin 8
6,8,5,4,9,1,10,6,7
1,4,5,6,7,8,9,10 2,3,11,12 5th spins 8
8,4,11,5,7,2,1,4,9
1,2,4,5,7,8,9,11, 3,6,10,12 1st spin 8
3,11,1,11,4,12,3,2,10,8
1,2,3,4,8,10,11,12 5,6,7,9 2nd spins 4
So far 44 unit within 7 games I think is really good.
Keep testing
Thanks For Sharing John
I have picked another random day from one of the online casinos that provides results.
spin 1. 30 <10> 1.
spin 2. 27 <9> 2.
spin 3. 2 <1> 3.
spin 4. 2 <1> 3. remember to cross out the 1 street on spin 3.
spin 5. 19 <7> 4.
spin 6. 5 <2> 5.
spin 7. 9 <3> 6.
spin 8. 36 <12> 7.
spin 9. 6 <2> 7. cross out the 2 street on spin 6.
spin 10. 36 <12> 7. cross out the 12 street on spin 8.
spin 11. 13 <5> 8.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
It has taken 11 spins to find the original 8 streets. The missing 4 are 4,6,8,11. These are the ones you will be playing on the first step of the progression.
Another option you could use is to wait for the original 8 streets to take as many spins as you like. It would slow your game down a bit however. You may set a rule where you will not play if the 8 original streets take any less than 15 spins to appear. This way using the 10 step progression means a dozen has to sleep for 25 spins. Yes that could happen but it is worth playing around with it to see what produces the most stable results.
spin 12. 19 <7> lost step 1. cross out the 7 street on spin 5.
spin 13. 14 <5> lost step 2. cross out the 5 street on spin 11.
spin 14. 17 <6> This is a win on step 3 of the progression and a profit of 8 units. Now you have 9 original streets and you can only play with 8. Here you will look at your numbers and cross out the furthest back street. The street you need to cross out is the 10 street which appeared on spin 1. That was a win on the third step of the progression and you can start again. The 4 missing streets are now 4,8,10,11. You will be betting on these on spin 15.
spin 15. 9 <3> Lost on step 1. cross out the 3 street on spin 7.
spin 16. 9 <3> lost on step 2. cross out the 3 street on spin 15.
spin 17. 28 <10> Win on step 3 of the progression. You would have won another 8 units here. You need to cross out the furthest back street which was the 9 street on spin 2. The 4 missing streets are now 4,8,9,11 which you will bet on the next spin. You are also starting at step 1 of the progression again.
spin 18. 29 <10> lost on step 1. cross out the 10 street on spin 17.
spin 19. 9 <3> lost on step 2. cross out the 3 street on spin 16.
spin 20. 30 <10> lost on step 3. cross out the 10 street on spin 18.
spin 21. 32 <11> win on step 4 of the progression. 8 unit win again. That is a total profit of 24 units now. You need to cross out the furthest back street which is the 1 street on spin 4. The missing 4 streets are now 1,4,8,9. You will back these starting from the next spin going back to step 1 in the progression again.
spin 22. 33 <11> lost on step 1. cross out the 11 street on spin 21.
spin 23. 9 <3> lost on step 2. cross out the 3 street on spin 19.
spin 24. 25. <9> win on step 3 of the progression. 8 units again and now 32 in front. If you were to carry on, you would now cross out the furthest back street which is the 2 strret on spin 9. The 4 missing streets are now 1,2,4,8.
That is a longer example to work your way through and it is not difficult once you understand what you need to do.
Hello Janos, I don't use RNG myself. If I did, I would probably play this on the NON ZERO Betvoyager RNG casino.
I am testing from numbers that come from an authentic casino in Germany.
The sessions I have played live were all played at live tables. I have found autowheels in casinos to be unreliable for sleeper methods.
Well done on your results. :thumbsup:
It's pouring rain here today. Looks like a good opportunity for lots of testing. :yahoo:
I will type out 31 numbers that I just tested and the results below. That way if someone is testing and comes to the same conclusion, at least you know you are doing it right.
33,12,7,19,16,20,35,10,6,16,35,7,17,30,23,12,14,25,20,18,10,20,5,11,32,23,21,36,20,14,22.
wins on spin 15,17,18,19,23,25,28,31.
profits on each win 8,4,8,8,8,4,8,8. 56 units profit in 8 games.
winning progression step 1/2/1/1/4/2/3/3.
Very interesting.How its going?
Hello freestyler, I have passed the 1000 unit profit mark in my hand testing. The highest step I have went to in the progression is 8. I have had a 6 and a few 5's as well.
I tested some sessions using the autowheel at some of the online casinos and that threw up the step 8 from the progression. It could just be coincidence, however any sleeper method that I try on the autowheels always struggle.
By that I mean that they either bust out or come close to the end of the progression. I have noticed this over several years of testing sleeper methods. In my opinion the autowheels are a completely different beast altogether than a live wheel with croupier.
I am going to start another test soon where I stop at step 4 win or lose. If I am in profit I go back to step 1 again and start over. If I am in the red, I will double the bets and try and reach a profit. Once I reach a profit, I go back to the beginning again. So instead of using the full 10 step progression, I will be using a kind of sliding scale bet depending where I am. Any ideas on this would be appreciated. I think the general idea of this is good but a bust out will cost nearly 400 units. So I am going to try different variations.
Another point is the waiting time. There are times when you could get 8 original streets right from the start. This would give you the 4 sleepers that you need but then including the 10 step progression, that has only given you 18 spins. In a sample that I just tested, here are the first 26 numbers.
19,8,16,14,20,17,21,29,29,29,16,36,26,18,8,18,34,34,8,20,20,30,35,36,27,22.
It has taken 26 spins here to get 8 original streets and the 4 sleepers that you would now bet are streets 1,2,4,11.
You have already had 26 spins and now you are going to get a further 10 in the 10 step progression giving you a total of 36. That is DOUBLE the 18 spins that I mentioned earlier. Sure, the wheel has no memory but I know which one I would feel safer playing. Sure enough, a win came on the very next spin on street 1.
So you can vary things regarding the progression and regarding qualifying spins.
As an example of the kind of sliding scale bet I was describing earlier.
In game 1 you win on the first spin and win 8 units. In the second game you lose at step 4. So now you lost 28 units which has you down a total of 20 units. So you are looking to recover. In game three you double the stakes. You win on the second spin and win 8 units. This still has your total at -12. In game 4 you will need to continue with double stakes. You win on the first spin and win 16 units. Your new total is now +4. So you can stop the double stakes and revert back to the normal progression. On game 5 you win on the third spin and win 8 units. Your new total is +12. I hope that makes sense.
Hit rate is good, but progression is unable to hold for long run. I prefer flat bets.
ok allin, how about this for a suggestion. Just wait for the bet to qualify and then flat bet on the first and second spin. Stop if you lose them two bets and wait for the winner before starting again. If you win on the first spin = 8 profit. Win on the second spin = 4 profit. You could do the third spin for a break even.
There are times when it hits regularly on spins 1/2/3.
If you have did some testing on the flat bets, I would be interested in seeing your results. cheers.
I have tried, 3 steps flat bets last weekend at my local casino. From 48 pounds to 150 pounds it went. Later it came down to 97, that's where I withdraw.
Ok let me try 2 steps this weekend.
nice one Allin :thumbsup:
I am glad to hear you had some luck with it. I have did some more testing + playing with it.
In real life play, I have now went to step 10 on the progression and in my testing it has reached step 11. There is no step 11 in my progression ;D So that was a bust. But I had made 4 extra bankrolls before that happened.
The problem would come if you hit a few of them first up which could happen. It would be a long journey back from 700+ units to get back in profit again. I normally play it to win 5/6 games and take the money and run.
I will try the flat bet approach today when I visit the casino and see what happens.
It has rained all day today and rather than travel to the casino I decided to test this some more using the flat bet idea. It did not come out great for me. The progression held up fine going to step 7 once.
I think the reason I probably decided to use the progression with this is because of playing sleepers. The progression is there just in case things sleep for a bit longer than usual. If I was playing a system of hot numbers, I would probably prefer to play flat bets. So not much more to really say about this. I will leave it at that except to say that the progression is not too scary at 300 or so units. It is not like a few thousand or something.
In testing I was able to get in front over 1000 units before the bust came and since then it has recovered again to +1300 which is roughly 4 bankrolls. When I have tried it in the casino, I aim for about 5/6 wins and then quit. I suppose it really makes no difference and you could play less games or more games if you liked.
Thanks everyone for reading.
Hi
Here is my weekend session, not bad up by $84 with progression, it does goto step 9, my
heart was almost breaking.
Win Step Profit
7 4
5 4
3 8
5 4
9 8
2 4
1 8
1 8
2 4
1 8
1 8
1 8
3 8
Well done on a nice win Allin.
It can get to a stage where it's squeaky bum time. I reached step 10 the other day and that is the end of the road for my progression. I did not want to draw up a longer progression than 10 steps because I don't see the sense in throwing good money after bad. It's a shame that the game can't run smoothly like the last 8 results of your session. But that would be too much to ask for. It is great when you can sit and play 10 games or so without going past step 3 and it can be the easiest 60 units that you will ever win.
The only thing I can think of that might slow down some of the longer games is to have a qualifying rule for the streets.
Let me show you an example.
If you get the following streets appear in this order. 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8. You are now going to start the 10 step progression but this will only take you up to spin 18.
However if you had the streets appear in this order. 1,2,3,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5,4,5,6,6,2,4,3,7,8. Now your 10 step progression will take you to step 30. I know some people will say it makes no difference and doing it this way will make you miss out on earlier wins but it does seem to me that the wins that come late on in the 10 step progression are because the 8 qualifying streets all came out one after the other or very close to each other.
If your time is limited, trying it this way could become a grind and there is still no 100% guarantee but it is just another suggestion.
Here is another suggestion for anyone who likes to play online.
Go into the downloads section in this forum and then look at page 4 in the members only section.
You will see a programme called 'Magic streets v 1.0' by bjb007.
This neat little programme allows you to input numbers and it shows you how many spins streets have not appeared for. So my suggestion would be to wait for a combination of 4 streets to be missing for 15+ spins and then use the 10 step progression. It will save you doing any tracking on paper and could be good fun for anybody wanting to do some testing against any actuals that you may have. Let's share some results if you decide to try it. :thumbsup:
(I changed the above to 15+ because in my first test using some actuals I have went through over 100 spins and still could not find a situation where 4 streets were missing for 20 spins each. So it has to be practical. There were a few occasions where 4 streets reached 15 spins each missing and appeared very quickly)
I have downloaded the spins from the spielbank wiesbaden casino and have started from the 1st february, 2010 table 3. I have processed 27 spins and the 4 streets missing with their absence is as follows.
street 1 (15 misses)
street 3 (22 misses)
street 10 (20 misses)
street 12 (17 misses)
So all the 4 missing streets have a minimum of 15 missing spins.
The next number out was 36. So this would be a hit on the first spin for a profit of 8 units.
I think the waiting time for 15 missing is probably acceptable and a 10 step progression then takes you to spin 25.
So in effect considering the 4 streets equals a dozen, you are hoping a dozen will not sleep for any more than 25 spins. Now the only thing in the back of my mind here is taking the law of the third into account. After a cycle of 37 spins. There is often roughly 12 numbers missing. That also equals a dozen. So it does show this is in no way failproof and the bad hits will come. Don't you just love gambling. :)
As an example here are the first 5 results from the day I mentioned above.
Bet after spin 27. win on spin 28.
Bet after spin 34. win on spin 36.
Bet after spin 49. win on spin 50.
Bet after spin 52. win on spin 53.
Bet after spin 55. win on spin 57.
So the winning steps in the 10 step progression would be 1/2/1/1/2. Now this is just an extremely short example but I think it demonstrates a little bit about what I was saying in having some kind of qualifying rules for the 4 missing streets. The waiting time does not appear to be extreme either. There seems to be a big difference between waiting for 4 streets to be absent for 15 spins and 4 streets to be absent for 20 spins. (which is good for us really because it means we are getting winning hits within 5 spins)
(edit) the winning steps after 160 spins are as follows. 1/2/1/1/2/7/2/5/2/4/1/3/1/5/7/2/1. 17 winning games for an average 102 unit win.
(edit 2) getting some ok results testing this way. 2nd february 2010 table 3. winning games on steps 1/1/1/2/2/2/1/4.
I think another way to play which would be safer would be to wait for 5 streets to go missing for 15+ spins each. A 10 step progression would be more expensive and the waiting time would be longer but this would be my ideal variation on this type of method.
Hello john
Please check you email ;)
Will do in a minute Afonso :thumbsup:
Just to show a quick example of my ideal variation.
Here are the first results using 3rd february 2010. table 3.
for the 4 missing streets after 15+ missing spins each. wins on 1/1/2/7/5/1.
for the 5 missing streets after 15+ missing spins each. wins on 1/5/1. These results were over the same 52 spins.
What intrigues me about my ideal variation is that it is as close to a martingale bet as you will get and I would never dream of playing that. Also you could sit all day and wait for 15 red or black to appear consecutively before using a progression to attack the opposite colour. Doing it using the street variant will throw up a lot more opportunities and the bankroll required is not nearly as hefty as a straight up martingale.
Today also good, but one thing i noticed is that when you play dozens, you will be bored to death on the wait time.
But this method gives more betting opportunities
Now total profit is 124$
I just set 40$ profit is limit per day.
Winstep Profit
4 8
2 4
1 8
2 4
1 8
2 4
2 4
Glad to see you are winning with this Allin. I am having a great time using the 'magic streets' software. It makes it much easier than writing it all down on paper. You can see everything in an instant.
I tried a mixture today of waiting for the 4 furthest back streets to go missing for 15 spins minimum each and the 5 furthest back streets to go missing for 15 spins minimum each.
The winning steps for the 4 streets were 2/2/2/1/4/1/2/1/3/3/1/2/5/1/3/2/3/5/5/1/3/1.
The winning steps for the 5 streets were 2/3/1/1/3/1/1/1/4/4.
Obviously not as many opportunities with the 5 compared to the 4 but I feel safer playing that particular bet. Also the profits are not as great either but as always it's risk versus reward.
I should have said that the total spins played were 122.
So it is not as though you are sitting around waiting ages for qualifiers. It has opened my eyes a bit as to how long a good proportion of numbers can actually sleep for. It shows up how variance can take hold and probably wipe out someone's bankroll before they know what hit them.
Hi forumers.
The likelihood for an event with 25/37 prob. to happen 10 followed times is exactly 0,01983275 which it means that in mean you will find once each 50,42 trials.
the table goes like this:
10 0,019832746 50,42166167
11 0,013400504 74,62405927
12 0,009054395 110,4436077
13 0,006117834 163,4565394
14 0,004133672 241,9156783
15 0,002793021 358,035204
With the same progression (10 steps) i should wait for this to happen 6 times and then, and only then, start betting the 4 sleeping streets. for 10 times.
Under your point of view you may think that you loose bet opportunities. Not under mine.
All the best.
Betatester :)
It sounds like I will have to take my secretary to the casino to take a note of everything that going on with this system. I know it is not that complicated but there again most casinos I know are pretty loud places with drunk people in them. . , so it is hard to concentrate on getting your bets down correctly, tiring enough if you are playing an exact system with an exact progression, without having to keep a note of what the last spin was and how this has an effect on the overall picture about where you bet and how much. . .
Today it busted. Total loss I made is -236. :'( :'(
I'm testing this system stopping at the 5th step in progression and restarting back to 1, going pretty good so far, even with hitting past level 5 more than I was expecting. In about 200 spins I've got to levels 7 - 13 5 times. Actually that's not so much thinking about it, I'm up $348 right now, highest was $1,400, max drawdown so far is 212 units, I should mention too I'm using a modified version of the progression too, I played most of the spins with the following:
1 - +$8
2 - +$12
3 - +$12
5 - +$16
7 - +$12
Loss = -$72
I've now switched to:
2 - +$16
3 - +$16
4 - +$12
6 - +$12
10 - +$20
Loss = -$100
I'll keep testing this unless I bust completely :)
Up $612 at 289 spins, max drawdown same at 212 units, so far only one bad area of losses but it was evening out even while they were happening. I've changed my progression one final time to the following:
1 - $8
1 - $4
2 - $8
4 - $24
8 - $32
Loss - $64!
Pretty good profits for that loss eh? :D
Anyways, I know 289 spins is not a lot so I won't post again til I have a much longer trial with this.
Take care :)
Matty B
Hello nonk21, well done on your results. I am glad to see it is working for you.
There are many ways to play the basic concept. As always, we just don't know when that bad run is coming. It could be sooner rather than later. I am working on some other projects and therefore have not had much time to devote to this. On my last batch of testing playing the missing 4 streets waiting for a 15+ spin absence, I did have another bust. My total profits for it are still in the +. I started testing for 5 missing streets which had gone missing for 15+ spins and that is still not to fail. The only downside there is less bets but surprisingly not as few as you would imagine. Anyhow, thanks for posting up your results and I look forward to seeing how it pans out for you. :good:
hahahahahahaha ;D lol at allin he lost the lot ;D
I have played this system and think it is one of the better streets systems around. I use the magical streets software in the downloads section , track the streets until 4 streets are unhit then bet these 4 un hit trio's, the optimal starting point to bet seems to be from 12 spins to 14 spins . I won almost all the 5 stage progressions over 10 hour session on a real online wheel. Any one playing this system should generally do ok providing no more than 5 or 6 leg progression.
One bad game i remember was where none of the 4 un hit streets hit over long spin session and were very stubborn and actually missed a total of 25 times from the starting bet at about spin 14 pretty amazing bad luck!. Play a long progression on a bad game like this and your bankroll will vanish.
Out of a 10 hour playing session though this happened only once to me. :) I guess I was lucky.......
where is this magical street software i had a look in the download section didnt find it
Sarif,
Go into the downloads section in this forum and then look at page 4 in the members only section.
You will see a programme called 'Magic streets v 1.0' by bjb007. :thumbsup:
John,
(If you think this is too off the wall, please delete it. Just a wild idea. I don't want to clutter up your topic.)
I want to say right off that what I'm about to suggest will probably cause some of your readers to break out in hives at the thought. And we all know that different progressions don't change the overall odds of winning or losing, I think????
I'm suggesting what I think is the boffins method of betting.
If I remember correctly with the boffins bet you let it ride after each win and if you win a second time, you are up so you start over.
Now I don't expect you to endorse this method, but there might be someone reading this that would like to give it a whirl. It may even trigger another idea that we haven't considered yet. Who knows?
I think with some of the tweaks that have been suggested, this may have an excellent chance of winning.
The original way looks like there are too few back to back winners.
Whether it will win enough more for the extra risk, I don't know. Testing will tell.
Option #1.
Here's a brief explanation for how to do it.
Our 1st bet is 1 unit on our 4 lines. Win = +8. Lose = -4 As long as we are winning, stay at 1 unit on 4 lines.
(When you lose, we could stay at 4 units on each line for one more loss. W=+4 L=-8.)
This example will go to the let-it-ride betting after the 1st loss.l
So, we have lost once and are at -4, next:
bet 1 unit on 4 lines. If we win, we leave all 12 units on the table. In other words, we are now betting 3 units on each of our 4 lines. W=+28 L=-8
If we lose on either the 1st or 2nd bet, we have lost our 4 units. If we win 2 times we start over
If we lose, we again bet 1 unit on our 4 lines and then let-it-ride. W=+24 L-12
If we lose, we again bet 1 unit on our 4 lines and then let-it-ride. W=+20 L-16.
We continue to bet 1 unit on our 4 lines 4 more times and we will be at W=+4 L=-32
We bet 1 and let it ride 7 times before we have to go to 2 and let it ride to come out ahead on a win.
We can bet 2 units and let it ride 4 times, 3 units 3 times, 4 units 2 times, 5 units 2 times, 6-7-8-9 units 1 time each.
Counting our 1st loss which wasn't a let it ride bet, we have to lose 23 times either on the 1st or 2nd bet before we take a loss. That's the good news.
The bad new is if we lose the 23rd bet, we will be down 292 units on that attack.
This 292 units will be offset by any units won prior to the losing attack.
This is just an idea. I haven't tested this on this system, so buyer beware.
Option #2.
This is very similar to the above bet strategy except that once you enter the let it ride stage, every time you win on the 1st stage of a bet, you don't let everything ride, you take back your original bet and only let your winnings ride.
In other words let's say you have just bet 2 units on the 4 lines and won. You now have 24 units that you could bet as 6 units on 4 lines. Instead, keep your original 8 units and only bet the 12 units you won.
If you lose the 12 unit bet, you still have your 8 units and can place that same bet again. You still can't start over until you win 2 in a row, but this gives you more shots at hitting 2 in a row.
Unfortunately, since you don't win as much, the progression rises faster and thus fewer opportunities to win 2 in a row, that is unless you hit a lot of single wins in which case you could have a lot more chances to win.
As I have already stated, I have not tested either of these betting strategies.
A final thought, this will work much better with the 5 line method since you get a lot more double wins. It will, unfortunately, limit the number of losses before bust.
TEST! TEST! TEST!
GLC
Hello George, Thanks very much for your input, I am going to take a look at it.
I remember reading a book some years ago called the future gambler and the author thought it was possible to gain a small edge by playing a one step up as you win game. So your ideas certainly sounds interesting.
I will give it a whirl and get back to you with some results.
You can play successfully that idea but you have to adjust the strategy! Your strategy with the sleepers don't works. Mark spins until only 4 streets are left over (sleepers). Next, wait for a first hit on those 4 sleepers, that's a trigger to bet all 4 with your progression but only for one hit, then reset. That first hit happens around 25th-30th spin and your winning hit comes before spin 37.
That is 99% winning strategy.
Cheers Hermes
Quote from: hermes on October 27, 2010, 01:20:44 AM
You can play successfully that idea but you have to adjust the strategy! Your strategy with the sleepers don't works. Mark spins until only 4 streets are left over (sleepers). Next, wait for a first hit on those 4 sleepers, that's a trigger to bet all 4 with your progression but only for one hit, then reset. That first hit happens around 25th-30th spin and your winning hit comes before spin 37.
That is 99% winning strategy.
Cheers Hermes
Sounds right, patience is the only weapon against the house edge. One question, Hermes. If the first hit happens from the 25th spin and a second hit comes before spin 37, does that mean we need a 12 step progression? Personally I'd be more comfortable with a two stage, 5 step progression.
Jeromin
how do i play this im really confused reading from first post to last is there a dummys guide please help i would like to try this strategy.cheers
Jeromin, you will never need more than 10 step progression. The second hit comes mostly very soon. If the conditions meet at spin 25th you will be finished sooner, if at 30th you will get a hit until spin 37 anyway. Try it, it is amusing how it works.
Sarif, read it again. Repetition is the mother of wisdom.
Hermes
I played this system by just tracking until there are 4 un hit streets then bet these 4 streets and without waiting for them to hit first (trigger). I can't see how it makes a great deal of difference waiting for the trigger. The system either way is pretty solid. I won 10 hours of games without a bust with this method. :thumbsup: :D
If you play flat bet its solid, Just try 3 flat bets and stop. Quit when 25 units up and play other systems.
Hi John,
Just thought I would post to let you know am having good success with this on random. org random generated numbers, currently played 35 Sessions for a +220 profit ;)
I will continue testing over the next few days and hopefully get up to 250+ sessions. If this goes OK, will test on RNG wheel. :thumbsup:
Hi All,
Have now completed 100 Sessions to a total profit of +660 Units :clapping:
Will continue on testing with random. org numbers. . . . .
Spin Tester, out of curiosity, how excactly are you playing it.
Are you waiting for the 5 missing streets to go missing for 15+ spins each and then using the progression (my preferred way of dicing with death :D) or are you using some other alternative.
cheers and glad you are enjoying testing this idea. :thumbsup:
Here is the way I personally test.
I use actuals from the Spielbank Wiesbaden Casino and open up the 'magic streets v 1.0' software that you will find in the downloads.
All you need to do is input the numbers. Here is an attatchment that shows you.
[attachimg=#]
So here, you can see that the 5 missing streets are 6, 8, 9, 10 and 12. They have all went missing for 15+ spins each. Now you use the progression (you can make up whatever progression you like) You will notice that you would have had a win 2 spins later on the number 36. To get the first bet takes a few spins, but after that, you will be surprised how frequently they come.
I have did a lot of testing with this variation and the highest step I have went to in a progression is 8. That is over thousands of spins.
Of course a loss is out there waiting to happen, it could come sooner rather than later. On saying that, it can be a steady earner and it is possible to build up a few bankrolls before the bust comes and that would certainly cushion the blow. Enjoy. :)
Hi John,
I think I am playing the original variation of the system. . . . .
Have now played 200 Sessions, the first 160 were from random. org and the final 40 were dublinbet actuals.
My profit now stands at +1336, stats are. . . . .
Bets to Win Profit
1st Spin after Qualify Times - 72 Profit - 576
2nd Spin after Qualify Times - 40 Profit - 160
3rd Spin after Qualify Times - 23 Profit - 184
4th Spin after Qualify Times - 29 Profit - 232
5th Spin after Qualify Times - 9 Profit - 36
6th Spin after Qualify Times - 10 Profit - 40
7th Spin after Qualify Times - 6 Profit - 24
8th Spin after Qualify Times - 6 Profit - 48
9th Spin after Qualify Times - 4 Profit - 32
10th Spin after Qualify Times - 1 Profit - 4
Totals Sessions 200 Total Profit - 1336
I track spins until 4 street have not been seen, then bet as per progression. Once I have a win, the betting spins are added to the bottom of my tracking list, and I then cross off from the top of the list until I have another 4 unique streets. I then bet as per progression again, rinse and repeat. I quite like playing this way as once the tracking has been done, you usually get quite a lot of betting opportunities.
I have also developed a different progression which takes advantage of the fact that the majority of wins come between 1 and 5 spins after you have qualified through tracking, which is;
3,4,5,6,11,17,25,37,56,84 (Per Street Bet)
24,20,16,16,16,12,8,4,4,8 would be the profit for each bet, which takes advantage of the fact I just stated above.
This progression would have given me over 6000 units profit in the same 200 sessions!! It does however lose a total of 1000 units should you go beyond the 10th spin. I have not used this yet, just developed the progression on my tracking spreadsheet.
I have paper tested several systems so far using both random. org numbers and actuals and can honestly say I havent yet seen one that hasnt at some point burst through the top of its progression. . . . . . until now. Even if I had burst once using the original progression, my profit would still be almost 1000 units!! I have only come close to this (9th or 10th spin) a total of 5 sessions out of 200!!
I am going to continue testing, either using actuals or playing a live wheel, and will continue to post my findings ;D I dont think it will take me much convincing to try playing this with real money at dublinbet. . . . .
Hello Spin Tester, thanks for such a detailed report. It is nice to get some feedback.
I am going to take a look at your progression, it looks interesting. A lot of the wins do come early and that looks a great way to benefit.
On a side note, they used to be a guy on the roulette forums years ago called 'ivorsmallholding' Anyway, he had developed a system for sectors and he swore by using a progression much like yours to take advantage of the early wins.
Back on topic, here is another attatchment from the same actuals I used in the example above and this shows the next bet. This time, the 5 missing streets are 2, 8, 9, 11 and 12. You will see there was a win on the very next spin on number 24. The only downside here is that it took a further 40 or so spins for a bet. That is not normal as anyone will see if they do some testing. The bets normally come quicker than that.
[attachimg=#]
The way I look at it is like this. If you have 5 streets missing for 15+ spins and then use a 10 step progression, that takes you to 25 spins. It is a rare occurence that it will go a full 25 spins without one of those 5 missing streets hitting. Now it maybe that this has no edge whatsoever, but what I like about it is the fact that you can build up some steady wins. It has to better than just going and scattering your chips anywhere (although some will disagree) Anyway, thanks again Spin Tester and I look forward to hearing how your testing develops.
Here is another quick example from a random day I chose from the Spielbank Wiesbaden Casino.
[attachimg=#]
I will list out on what spin the bet came, when the win came, and the number of spins it took to get the win.
1) spin 28 - 33 (5)
2) spin 33 - 34 (1)
3) spin 34 - 35 (1)
4) spin 68 - 69 (1)
5) spin 70 - 71 (1)
6) spin 71 - 74 (3)
Nothing there to give anyone heart failure ;D On my testing with the 5 missing streets waiting for 15+ spins variation,the average is about a bet every 12 spins. That may not be to everbody's liking. I like it as a good hit and run strategy. 100 spins should give you about 7 or 8 bets. Make a few units and quit with a profit. :)
Hi John,
Started testing on Spielbank Wiesbaden spins, not so good so far, 2 total losses but profit would still be +888 units.
Will continue testing. . . . . .
8)
Cheers Spin Tester, I stopped testing the 4 missing streets version a while ago. I did have 3 progression busts in a row. Sh*t happens ::) I still ended up in the + testing that way, but not by much over a lot of spins.
It will be interesting to see if my 5 street variation heads the same way. Progressions are great when they are working, however they do give the illusion that you have a great system when that may not necessarily be the case.
I will do some more testing over the weekend myself and post up the figures when I have finished. :thumbsup:
Hi, what progression are you using for 5 streets?
Hi John,
A further 50 real spins test, and profit now at +816, but included another progression burst.
I think Ill stop testing this one as I think it will burst the progression once every 50 sessions or so, which would be a lot of work for little profit as you have just eluded to.
I will have a look at your 5 street system over the next week or so, and see what I can come up with in the way of testing and results. . . . . .
Spin
On the plus side this system during my own personal tests at times held out over very very long sessions at the online wheel. I rate this system 7.5 out of ten. This is a method I would play again- well done for one reasonably good system. :)
better than a lot of other whacko methods around. :clapping:
Just so I can finally put the original version of this system to bed, using real spins and the original progression and after 100 sessions it would be minus 520 units. Using my more aggressive progression, and the same 100 sessions it would be down to minus 200 units.
I am going to try the 5 street sleeper later tonight when I can d/l the software, and will report back my findings.
:thumbsup:
550 spins of the wheel, real wheel numbers, +206 units. . . . .
as stated by John earlier, the play is quite slow, I think 550 spins might take over 10 hours, however I havent seen the progression go past the 8th step (out of 10) so it feels quite safe. . . . . its only gone over the 5th step in the progression twice (once to 6 and once to 8 ). . . . . . and who really cares how slow the winning is?!?!?
The progression I am using is;
Step 1 - 1 chip (5 total) - 7 Profit
Step 2 - 2 chips (10) - 9 Profit
Step 3 - 3 chips (15) - 6 Profit
Step 4 - 5 chips (25) - 5 Profit
Step 5 - 9 chips (45) - 8 Profit
Step 6 - 15 chips (75) - 5 Profit
Step 7 - 26 chips (130) - 7 Profit
Step 8 - 44 chips (220) - 3 Profit
Step 9 - 76 chips (380) - 7 Profit
Step 10 - 130 chips (650) - 5 Profit
Dunno if anyone can suggest a better progression (John, maybe???) as it this one tanks it loses 1555 units!!!
However, will continue testing at this level and see what happens.
Playing progressions looks very good "on paper" the only problem is when your putting real money down and not just fun chips , i have systems where i can win every stage of my progression but when you have thousands of pounds all depending where a ball drops it sort of sucks and takes pleasure out of the game. :(
Hello Spin Tester + Kingspin :thumbsup:
Spin, It is slower, but it is safer. As for the progression, I like the one you are using because it covers 10 steps and gives you a decent profit on each win. If you are more risk averse and don't mind just going to 8 steps. . Here is one that only costs 345 units. The average profit per win is only 4 units. With your one, I see it is about 6. There is a big difference in the risk however. In all my testing with the missing 5 streets, I have never went past step 8 yet.
1) 5 x 1 = 5. win 12. profit 7 / lose 5.
2) 5 x 1 = 5. win 12. profit 2 / lose 10.
3) 5 x 2 = 10. win 24. profit 4 / lose 20.
4) 5 x 3 = 15. win 36. profit 1 / lose 35.
5) 5 x 6 = 30. win 72. profit 7 / lose 65.
6) 5 x 10 = 50. win 120. profit 5 / lose 115.
7) 5 x 17 = 85. win 204. profit 4 / lose 200.
8. 5 x 29 = 145. win 348. profit 3 / lose 345.
What may happen here because the variation is slower, is for it to just take longer for it to even itself out. This may not be a bad thing if you play for real, because then it really does give you a decent chance to build up a few bankrolls. I don't think we can really ask for anything more than that when playing these type of methods.
Quote from: John Gold on November 15, 2010, 08:35:55 PM
Hello Spin Tester + Kingspin :thumbsup:
Spin, It is slower, but it is safer. As for the progression, I like the one you are using because it covers 10 steps and gives you a decent profit on each win. If you are more risk averse and don't mind just going to 8 steps. . Here is one that only costs 345 units. The average profit per win is only 4 units. With your one, I see it is about 6. There is a big difference in the risk however. In all my testing with the missing 5 streets, I have never went past step 8 yet.
1) 5 x 1 = 5. win 12. profit 7 / lose 5.
2) 5 x 1 = 5. win 12. profit 2 / lose 10.
3) 5 x 2 = 10. win 24. profit 4 / lose 20.
4) 5 x 3 = 15. win 36. profit 1 / lose 35.
5) 5 x 6 = 30. win 72. profit 7 / lose 65.
6) 5 x 10 = 50. win 120. profit 5 / lose 115.
7) 5 x 17 = 85. win 204. profit 4 / lose 200.
8. 5 x 29 = 145. win 348. profit 3 / lose 345.
What may happen here because the variation is slower, is for it to just take longer for it to even itself out. This may not be a bad thing if you play for real, because then it really does give you a decent chance to build up a few bankrolls. I don't think we can really ask for anything more than that when playing these type of methods.
Hi John,
This progression looks a lot safer as less chips are being risked - I too have not seen the progression go beyond 8 steps (yet!!) so will use this in my further testing.
Thanks again, will report back my findings in the next couple of days :thumbsup:
Quote from: Kingspin on November 15, 2010, 08:22:38 PM
Playing progressions looks very good "on paper" the only problem is when your putting real money down and not just fun chips , I have systems where I can win every stage of my progression but when you have thousands of pounds all depending where a ball drops it sort of sucks and takes pleasure out of the game. :(
I understand this totally, and wouldnt feel comfortable myself placing thousands of pounds to win a couple back..... thats why I am conducting all my testing using Spielbank Wiesbaden Casino spins as they are real numbers and not RNG ones, as they (for me) are more reliable for testing....
I beleive there are a couple of real online wheels available that allow you 0.10c chips; therefore using Johns progression he just stated your maximum bankroll burst is 345 chips, or $34.50. I would never start to play any system for real money with less than 3 full bankrolls, and $100 seems about right for this. It looks so far to be a slow but reliable system and hopefully more testing will show this. If it stands up to 500 sessions (on this system that would be around about 3500 spins I am guessing) and shows a profit then I would be happy to put $100 of my own money in 8)
I have just changed to your progression, and would be +149 units from the sessions (1-29) above. Less profits, but less risk....
Will continue testing tonight :)
burst the progression twice, now at -458 :nono: :nono: :nono:
think thats all I need to see, am going to have a look at the progression and see if I can work it, but think thats testing over :skull:
Well Spin, them results are a shame. It probably goes to show what many of us already suspect. Hot numbers, cold numbers, all a load of cobblers. :sarcastic:
I thought the bet selection and progression could buy us some time, but it does really show that you just can't say because 15 numbers have not appeared for 20 spins or whatever, that they are due to hit. In that respect, progressions really are an illusion and it is just a matter of time before the bubble is burst.
What this should do is to maybe help some people move in another direction now and look for alternative ways to beat the wheel. I am not being negative, far from it.
Thank you Spin for going to the time and trouble to test this idea. :)
John Gold is so right!
Progressions are NOT the answer. I thought we ALL would have learned this much so far. But I guess not!
Insidebet
Hey John, no problems testing for you, am glad we can all draw some conclusions from my doing so.....
:D
Dear fellow Roulette Lovers,
I posted a system on another forum that involved a 20 step grand martingale type system for betting on the oldest 6 number street.
It won so much in the little steps, approximately 1 unit per spin, that I thought it would stay ahead of the losses.
It did for a lot of testing. 2000 spins worth of testing.
I thought that somehow I had discovered THE system. I was shocked that none of the old timers had figured it out before me. Good thing I came along to fetch everybody up to speed on how to beat roulette.
Then.........3 losses in one test session. The oldest 6 number street slept over 30 times 3 separate times in 350 spins.
Out of nowhere, I was in the dumps and quickly posted my results and encouraged others to run like hell from this system.
Kingspin is 100% correct. It's important for us to listen to people like him because I know that he often plays for real money and can win or lose a thousand or two.
When he says that it's a big difference to write 250 units on a piece of paper when testing vs plopping down 250 bucks on a live wheel and knowing that if you lose, your next bet is going to have to be 500 or whatever, the nerves of steel turn to jelly.
I'm startng to get a better understanding about what some of the vererans means when they tout flat betting or at best a small progression.
Progressions always get corrected with a losing run. The longer the progression, the longer it may take to pay the piper, but he will be paid.
At least with short progressions, you pay him more often and in smaller amounts so you know how the system is really working up to date.
A flt bet tells how the system is doing real-time. A 5 step progression is putting off the real results into the near future, but a 15 step progression is putting it off so far out there that we actually think we are winning.
Just rambling a little. Hope this helps somebody save their bankroll.
It's like a good friend of 3 score and 10 years (most of those years playing roulette) told me, "Better to get wounded than killed."
Regards,
George
hi john - have been testing my own 5 street system using cold streets though slightly different from yours. i would recommend not using the coldest of the streets as i have personally seen them sleep a helluva long time and as such your wasting units.